Top Ten Reasons Why Ivypool Is Better Than Dovewing (Warriors)

Yeah. The two sisters. One is my favorite and the other.. , not so much
The Top Ten
1 Dovewing acts like an idiot sometimes

Absolutely. When Dovewing lost her powers, she totally lost it, and didn't really think of others. I mean... HELLO? Did we see Lionblaze and Jayfeather acting like they were dirt? I mean sure, they had to figure out how to cope with their own power loss, but they didn't shun their loved ones, and go sulk somewhere.

Dovewing thinks she's so smart, and she should be, for her powers tell her almost everything there iss. Instead she doesn't bother to learn and is a complete idiotic dumb cat. Please, Erin Hunter, make her make better life decisions. - Honeyspirit

SO DOES LIKE EVERYCAT. Ivypool whines and complains about her sister not wanting her, and then pushes her sister away when Dovewing tries to include her in stuff and Dovewing DOES care about her sister. if she didn't love her sister then why would she beg Jayfeather to tell Ivypool the truth about the prophecy? Why would she tell her about Tigerstar? Because she's worried about her.

Again, in her opinion the world revolves around her "Loyalty? What's that?" "Kindness? Never heard of them. Are they cute?"

2 Even after the battle, Ivypool fought for her rights

Ivypool, as a cat who trained in the Dark Forest, had to prove and re-prove herself over and over while Dovewing sat there examining her claws and not lifting one of them to help her. - Honeyspirit

Even though Ivypool didn't need to, she still agreed to an oath of loyalty and worked her tail off. Dovewing on the other hand just sulked.

YEA! Ivypool fought so much in her life that I think she needs a rest sometimes.

See Ivypool will always fight for what she thinks is right. dovewing on the other hand...

3 Ivypool was tricked and then she tricked them

Ooooo Ivypool wanted to make up for her mistake! When Dovewing told her she was being tricked, she instantly had an Idea! What if she could make this useful and spy on them?! Of course, she had to kill somebody doing so and I didn't like that part but she had to for her clan. Nobody said she wanted to, besides, she was in the battle of the death, of course somebody was gonna die! -IvypoolfanknownasWidowsight

So true though, ivypool is a trickster!

4 Dovewing is a Mary-Sue

I'm tired of seeing people arguing who of the sisters is better! To be honest, I love them BOTH and there are not many people who think like me.

I love them because they have flaws - Dovewing's whining is a flaw (stop calling her a Mary Sue.) She can act stupid sometimes and be stubborn (these are flaws too). If she was a Mary Sue, she would know that her falling in love with Tigerheart is wrong! Other flaws (from dlrTsTrlpE's comment) are that she is indecisive, works badly under pressure, tries to help but only makes things worse, has a lack of self-control and judgement, keeping secrets from trusted cats. When Dovewing lost her powers, it was normal to whine for it because it is like feeling that she is deaf.

Ivypool, on the other hand, has flaws - can be super jealous and mean. She pushed Dovewing away, not understanding that Dovewing wanted her sister to be happy (this is a flaw). And I have to say that everyone was a bit jealous a bit in their life! Yeah, Ivypool ...more

Dovewing is actually a lot more flawed than Ivypool. Her appearance isn't mary sueish, and she has flaws! She is stubborn, naive, and pretty idiotic. And she never seemed to be that good of a fighter either. And just because she has two toms who love her, doesn't mean she's perfect! I mean, Crowfeather had three mates/love interests, yet he's not even close to a gary stu! If you're gonna complain about Dovewing, complain about Ivypool too, because she honestly has less flaws than Dovewing!

PURE MARY SUE. Well, that's my opinion. Dove just always does the right thing! Even when she's doing bad things, it's like she's doing something good!-Shadowstrike of Silentclan.

I can name you fifty flaws but I'll just name a few, indecisive, a bit stubborn, works badly under pressure, tries to help but only makes things worse, a lack of self control and judgement, and keeping secrets from trusted cats

5 Everybody loved Dovewing and she was complaining the whole time

"Thanks," Ivypaw mewed, watching her mentor as she followed the other warriors. She gave Dovepaw a hard shove. "Stop showing off." Dovepaw stared at her incredulous. "But Ivypaw, you-" "You're only doing it to get attention," Ivypaw hissed. Before Dovepaw could respond, she bounded away and vanished into the apprentice's den" -The Fourth Apprentice, page 71-72

Dovewing cared about her sister, her sister pushed Dovewing away. Ivypool yelled at Dovewing all the time.
Ivypool was always saying she should be with Bumblestripe because Tigerheart/Star was from ShadowClan, but Dovewing flat out said that she did not like Bumblestripe, who was always playing with Dove's feelings.
Ivypool doesn't give a crap about Dovewing. Ivypool expects Dovewing to listen but Ivypool was always screaming at her like Dovewing could read her mind.
Ivypool always said Dovewing was just her shadows and got attention. But it isn't Dove's fault she has powers! Dovewing loved her sister and cared ...more

Dovewing, I think, is not a Mary Sue, however she is complaining about her powers throughout Bramblestar's Storm. She acts like every cat can see beavers making a dam or Leopardstar dying in the fourth apprentice, when clearly what elders, her mother, and other warriors must have told her prove it wrong! My problem is not only she complained, she complained while she was loved by her Clanmates and kin and it was as if she thought every cat hated her instead of adoring her like a sister/mate. - Honeyspirit

Dovewing did complain, but honestly Ivypool complained a lot more! Ivypool was always like "Oh everyone loves Dovewing and nobody likes me!" She never tried to understand how Dovewing was feeling, and lashed out on her all the time.

1. She did care for Ivypool. Ivypool kinda treated her like dirt in Fading Echoes because of her jealousy. Dovewing didn't really treat her like trash, only as an apprentice a bit because Ivypool was the one who started it.
2. Dovewing wasn't with Tigerheart all the time. She also began to use her senses, and think - Have you ever thought how Dovewing woke Ivypool up when she was in the Dark Forest so Ivypool could suffer less?
3. The reason she whined was because she was used to her powers. Think of it - You were able to see a oak tree from a hundred of miles away while sitting in front of a television, but then something happens and you only see the television like if you zoomed a hundred times?
4. Rather Dovewing not act like a real mate to Bumblestripe, or Bumblestripe to get a new mate that does like him? I honestly don't care about forbidden relationships, since it was just part of the code to not have a mate from another Clan, pretty much explained in Code of the Clans.

6 Dove freaked out when she lost her powers

Yes, I get that Dove should be a little uncomfortable without her powers but I believe that she acted a bit dramatic. She kept complaining, were jay or lion doing that? No! I think Dove was kinda acting like a kit. Dove shouldn't just complain, but understand that other cats have the same senses as her EVERY DAY. It kinda made me feel like she just wanted people to like her and when she lost her powers she felt like the attention would go to Ivy, thus, making her more whiny. Please do not attack me, this is just my opinion.-Darklight.

Because she was born with her powers! Unlike Jayfeather and Lionblaze who used their powers only sometimes, Dovewing's powers were in use 24/7. Of course she'd feel like she was deaf, because her senses aren't as good as they used to be!

Dovewing was born with powers. She grew up with them. She learned everything when she had her powers. She used them ALL THE TIME. They were a part of her life.
OF COURSE she would freak out when she lost them! Imagine wearing glasses your whole life and then losing them. How blind would you feel? And I know that wearing glasses doesn't nearly compare to the abilities that Dovewing's powers gave her.
Dovewing was so accustomed to her powers, so of course she would feel upset and confused when she lost them! I don't understand how this is a problem with Dovewing's character. Her reaction only feels realistic to me. I would freak out too!

I mean yeah she did have powers since she was born, but I think she was a bit too over dramatic. I didn't see Jayfeather screeching like that even though he's BLIND and he revolves around people's thoughts. I didn't see Lionblaze freaking out that he wasn't powerful anymore, they both adapted to it.

7 Dovewing was rude to Bumblestripe, lied to her sister, complained that she was blind and deaf when she lost her powers, and made poor decisions that not only affected her, but the cats around her as well.

Rude to Bumblestripe: Um… Bumblestripe was a creep. He is one of my least favorite characters. Dovewing was right to leave him!

Lied to her sister: She really wanted to tell Ivypaw about her powers, but Lionblaze and Jayfeather told her not to! That wasn't her choice!

Complained that she was blind and deaf when she had lost her powers: I mean, I would too. The powers felt normal to her!

Made poor decisions: Yes, she made some bad decisions, but those just make her a better character!

Also, how do the points you are making make her a Mary Sue?

I know Dovewing thought everything she did was for the better, but it just made her Mary Sue level up to 40%. Being rude, lying, and complaining is never better than whatever! - Honeyspirit

So, for one Dovewing snapped at Bumblestripe ONCE, and you're saying that it makes her rude? let's see Head Bitch- I mean Ivypool over here, Ivypool snapped at her sister when she tried to include her in things, she tried to convince her sister that the dark forest cats were good, AND she started training with her grandfather's enemies, poor decisions that affected the cats around her? Thunderclan didn't need her anymore and, Shadowclan needed more warriors so she brought back the guardian cats

So? You complain she's a mary sue, and this lists many of the mistakes she's made.

8 Ivypool had to deal with a type of depression

Okay . . . No she didn't. I'm too lazy to type all my comments for every single reason, so.
1. Not really
2. Uhh . . . no
3. Well, a lot of other cats did it too. Gray and Silver doesn't get hate
4. Yes
5. Rarely
6. No!
7. Yeah
8. Yeah
9. No.
10. Uhh not THAT mean . . .
11. Who wouldn't?
12. I'm pretty sure Dovewing would too.
13. Uh. I don't know what to say for this one
14. Humble? I guess
15. Well. Not pointless.
16. Obviously. People who say she's useless need to reread the books.
17. No.
18. No.
19. No.
20. Yes
21. ...
22. No.
23. Well, not exactly. She didn't do it intentionally.
24. Idts
25. That depends on the person, but I guess Ivypool MIGHT be slightly more pretty In my opinion
26. No
27. Well, I guess, but she had a good reason not to
28. ... and Dovewing is?
29. Isn't this the same thing as 27#?
30. No
31. You don't know that
32. Everyone complains at one point. She doesn't ...more

Ivypool, who is my favorite, had to deal with snarky comments on how Dovewing was better, and this is why Blossomfall is one of my absolute least favorite cats. Dovewing didn't have to hunt every mouse, leave something for Ivypool from time to time! Other cats viewed her as something like "the best hunter" while it was not because she was good at it, it was because StarClan had given her powers. I absolutely am angry at Dovewing for letting other cats bully her sister while she clearly could have heard that! - Honeyspirit

I didn't see any signs of depression in Ivypool at all. Just a brat who's jealous of her sister (I like Ivypool, but there's no doubt that she was a brat to Dovewing when she was younger)

Mistcloud/Mist That Covers Vision: WHAT KIND OF REASONS ARE THIS. Dovewing did all she could to save the clans, while you're here giving more praise to Ivypool. Why? Because you feel sorry for her. I know, and sometimes I do sympathize for her too, but if Dovewing didn't hear that tree, Ivypool's spying part wouldn't have a purpose, because Thunderclan is already dead.

9 Dovewing fell in love with a ShadowClan

Ok, I'm gonna be honest. I HATE Tigerheart. But honestly, I'm glad she left ThunderClan to join him. It's rare that we get a cat that chooses love over Clan, and this doesn't make Dovewing a bad cat. But I absolutely loathed their romance, so I'll give you that.

I don't care that this created a very important protagonist. I don't care that it took a cat out of ThunderClan, the overflow of cats. I don't care that "Oh, but Dovewing is 'special' ". It is against the warrior code, and DOVEWING BE EVIL!

So? Graystripe and Silverstream don't get hate. But Dovewing does? Half the ships are forbidden. Bluestar...Leafpool...reread the dang books.

Oh boy, forbidden love!
Why, Erin(s), why? You drove this trope into the ground.

I don't care about "ships", I care about plots, and this one is adds more garbage to the so-called "storyline".

Poor Bumblestripe, a truly nice cat in the same Clan, turned away because the glorified Dovewing wanted to get down with a different cat from a different clan.

What a disappointment.

10 Ivypool was determined to stop the dark forest

Hey Ivypool haters I know some of the reasons on this list aren't true but this one is, so let her go for once! There are plenty of things dovewing and Ivypool both did for their clan, so stop it! Ivypool risked a lot to go to the Dark Forest, and even if she didn't report much to the Three, she still WENT there, like a brave cat. Dovewing risked a lot going to stop the beavers, and used her powers to help her clan, and Ivypool turned half of the Dark Forest on her side during the fight, while also spying on them for information. and to the people who hate her for not reporting much information, it's because she didn't think there was much useful information. I mean, I guess she could have told the Three which thunderclan cats were going to the Dark Forest, but could you really tell on your dad?Dovewing and Ivypool are both good characters, BACK OFF HATERS OF BOTH CATS, they both aren't Mary Sues either. Omg I basically wrote the same exact comment for glory/tsunami haters :/ come on ...more

Imagine if you lived your whole life, set aside and shadowed buy another sibling. Not only that, but they were unaware that they did so. When you tried to tell them, they just accused you of being jealous and that they were always better than you. (Fading Echoes) By now, the person reading this should know that they're acting as Ivypool. Anyways, once Ivypool found a way to compete with her sister, she took it as her only hope. That hope was fighting, and through the dark forest. Once Ivypool figured out the dark forest were purely evil, she risked her life to spy and give information. When all came down to the battle, Ivypool was the main reason the dark forest didn't win the battle. She stayed loyal to Thunderclan and almost died while protecting her belief. Now, Dovewing, is...a different story. Dovewing whines all thetime, when she has everything a she-cat could want. She broke and mended Tigerheart's heart a numerous amount of times, showing that she doesn't really care. She ...more

Ivypool was spying on the Dark Forest, trying to find out ways to defeat them, while you know what Dovewing does? She falls in love with a cat training there! As an Ivypool fan, I would like my say in this. - Honeyspirit

They offered her a chance to prove that she was as good as her sister so obviously she took it. Then Ivypool found out they were just using her. If I was her, I'd want to stop them too.

The Contenders
11 Dovewing whined about pointless relationships.

Dovewing:Bumblestripe I'm breaking up with you cause I Have a kind mate that is related to me in Shadowclan Bumblestipe:What, that's pointless Dovewing:SHUT UP I'm joining Shadowclan because I don't get treated right here. I totally agree with this one.

Her Sister spied in Cats From hell in her dreams.
Dovewing whined about a prophecy and pointless relationships

Dopewing is so annoying like literally she is too overrated.

True. that's literally all she did besides complain about her powers

12 Dovewing didn't care about her sister

Ok, this is absolutely ridiculous. Dovewing absolutely cared for her sister. She didn't want Ivypool to be jealous of her, and tried to talk it out with her. Ivypool kept lashing out at her. Dovewing didn't want her powers, and wanted to tell her about the prophecy, but stupid Lionblaze wouldn't let her! Ivypool was way too clingy to her and didn't understand that she and Dovewing wouldn't always be together.

Okay Ivypool is in my opinion is the better sister, but this is a huge lie! Dovewing cared about her sister in every book starting with them! She even wanted Ivypool to be the SPIOLOR ALERT!

fourth cat! And most of these reasons are opinions and most no evidence. -IvypoolfanknownasWidowsight

Oh my gosh I hate these reasonings. use LOGIC people. she's proved her actions that she does love Ivy. It even said at one point that she wouldn't have left her sister for Tigerheart, because she loved her more. And if she didn't love her sister then why would she beg Jayfeather to tell Ivypool the truth about the prophecy? Why would she tell her about Tigerstar? Because she's worried about her. She's even said to Jayfeather that she's worried about her sister training in the Dark Forest, about what he might do to her, that she might get killed. She constantly told Ivy over and over again that she doesn't have to spy because she is worried about her. How is her love for her sister not shown? It's been shown multiple times.

Tbh-- Dove is a whiny piece of crap she complained about her powers the whole time she had them- but when they disappeared she was freaking out!

13 Dopewing ruined everything

Her name is not DOPEWING, won't you just leave her alone?! Dovewing had serious things going on! Tigerheart, Her powers, she saved her clan, Ivypool was being a lazy kittypet!

She ruined every thing!
1, When ivypool need help, dopewing was playing with tigerheart! she even care about her sister!
2, she was useing her power to spying tigerheart! not for her clanmates! I'd rather give it to someone who's trying to do it than complain about it.
3, she always complaining about her powers! I'm so be frightened of her words!
4, the power of three become to lion, jay, AND HOLLY! NOT STUPID DOPEWING who betraying her clan and warrior code!

Oh yes she did

14 Dovewing sucks

That's, an opinion, there is no evidence in this. I like Ivypool more then Dovewing but seriously, people are running out of ideas.

No, Ivypool does, because the brainless little fox though the Dark Forest was GOOD

Yes- Dove does suck, she sucks more then the badgers that killed Cinderpelt

15 Dovewing was super mean to Bumblestripe

DUDE. STOP. Dovewing NEVER loved Bumblestripe! She was pressured to be mates with Bumblestripe. A love triangle doesn't automatically make someone a Mary-Sue. Just because Dovewing had two toms who liked her doesn't make her a terrible cat. Dovewing was never even actually in a relationship with Bumblestripe. Squirrelflight had FOUR after her (Brambleclaw, Ashfur, Stormfur, and Shrewpaw) and do I see people complaining?

Dove Wing obviously didn't like him and he didn't back off. Dovewing should not be forced to love someone and if Bumble Stripe is SUPER creepy

To the person before, If she was unhappy why did she become mates with him in the first place?

She couldn't even bear to be nice to him. That doesn't mean she had to be mates with him, but she was SO RUDE

16 Ivypool would die to her clan

Ivypoop is litterly the BIGGEST MARY SUE EVER! at least Dovewing has flaws!
1. Loving to toms at once
2. Dealing with her power
3. Coping with Ivypool
AND MORE! ''Top Ten Reason Why DOVEWING Is Better Then Ivypool! "
Ivypool's flaws. She doesn't whine. She expressed her feelings bitterly. She doesn't fall in love. She doesn't have any flaws. SHE'S. NOT. RELATABLE. EITHER! At one point she's TAUNTING HER SISTER! WHAT KINDA OF MATURE OLDER SISTER WOULD DO THAT? Ivypool is the most annoying, biggest Mary Sue, and is my 10th least fave.

Dovewing would also.

17 Dovewing is just horrible
18 Ivypool is humble

She is humble! She spied in the DarkForest every night, willing risking her life for her Clan without so much as a complain! Unlike her sister. Dovewing had her whole Clan's attention, and all she had to do was listen, and she was complaining her head off. Ivypool deserved so much more credit than Dovewing. Without her, the Clans would probably be destroyed anyways since there's only one Lionblaze and he could only fight at one place at a time.

Yes. She spied on the Dark Forest for her clan, and never bragged or went on about it. She deserves credit, much more than Dovewing.

What? When her was an apprentice, she was an attention hungry cat!

She wasn't very humble at first but I still like her!

19 Ivypool is not useless

SHE IS DEF NOT! She risked her life every night in cat hell and turned half of the cats against the DF (Dark Forest) She lied straight to the faces of the most menacing cats who lived and wasn't afraid.

Actually, if Ivypool hadn't warned the Clans, all four would have been destroyed.

She actually is useless. Ivypoop didn't do anything durning the battle with the DF.

No! Ivypool is the best!

20 Ivypool did brave tasks

I don't think I need to say anything. She almost died in cat hell every night.

She deserves more than dovewing and her kits need better names! Because thriftkit, flipkit, and bristlekit are probably too weird.

21 She ditched thunderclan

This is the main reason I like Ivypool better than Dovewing. This just pains me honestly when she left to be a rouge and then went to Shadowclan. Basically ditching her sister, if Tigerheart loved her so much, he would go to Thunderclan! Honestly, Dovewing cared about her sister the whole time and then just straight up left. I just can't stand that.


Very true. She left ThunderClan for her mate in ShadowClan because she was having kits. Dovewing's loyalty should remain with her Clan, and not go lumbering off to a new Clan only because of Tigerheart/star.

22 Dovewing shut Ivypool out

Quite the opposite. Ivypool shut Dovewing out, even when Dovewing tried to reason with her. I remember Dovewing lashing out at her once, but the argument itself was caused by Ivypool.

NOT TRUE! I'm an Ivypool fan but this is not what happened, Dovewing tried to get Ivypool to listen okay?! It's the other way around! -IvypoolfanknownasWidowsight

Nope. Ivy shut Dovewing out, Dovewing literally tries to include her sister in everything. These people need to reread the books

NO! Ivypool shut DOVEWING out! Dove tried to include ivy, but ivy just said no! Can't you Dummies see that?

23 Ivypool is prettier

Okay, an opinion again! Both sisters are really pretty, it just depends on how you draw them! Like sometimes, Ivypool looks very ugly and Dovewing looks very ugly, it just depends on how you draw them! But in real Warrior cats, I think there both beautiful


Not only is she prettier, but she had a reason to spend time in the Dark Forest, and it was because of a good cause! Dovewing completely ignored her and acted like a brat towards Ivypool. Ivypool is more highly skilled and more intelligent and knowledgeable, while Dovewing is annoying, lazy, and whiny. Lionblaze never gets hurt. Jayfeather can walk in dreams. And Dovewing... can... um... hear things...

24 Dovewing played with Bumblestripe's feelings

Dovewing played with Bumblestripe's FEELINGS! that's just rude. I know in Dovewing fans defense for her *she didn't know* or *she thought she liked him back* but then why did she go for Tigerheart a second time? There are some things I don't like about Dovewing. She's my third favorite so I don't hate her. I just have some problems with her. -IvypoolfanknownasWidowsight

That's not true! She didn't mean to! She didn't know how Bumblestripe felt about her!

25 Dovewing didn't pay attention to Ivypool once she got more attention

Yeah, Dovewing was all in the attention and Ivypool felt broken away. I know what this feels like because my sister is always said to be 'perfect' and MANY people (Including myself) think I'm imperfect.

Oml I hate Dovewing! Imma do a skit. that explain EVERYTHING.
Clan cats: Yay for Dovewing! She's so awesome!
Dovewing: I noe rigt people?! I lied to all of you, was super mean to Ivypool and Bumblestripe, Broke the warrior code, complained a ton, was a mary-sue, and I even shut my loser sister who is better than me out! I'm so awesome.
Ivypool: 'sarcastic' Oh, your majesty, you forgot to put an exclamation mark at the end. Oh. and you forgot to be nice, too...
Bumblestripe: Oml your right, Ivypool. Dovewing SUCKS!
Dovewing: Peasants! Get out of my way! You guys are SO meann! WAHH
Ivypool to Bumblestripe: Is she, like, fine in the head?
Bumblestripe to Ivypool: Uhh, probably not...
Tigerheart sneaks in and jumps in the conversation.
Tigerheart: Sorry 'bout my girlfriend, guys... I'll admit I don't know how we met...
Ivypool: Geez.. tell me about it...

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